The Trouble With Atheism (Tonight 8pm C4)

MIkkyo · Post by **MIkkyo** » December 18th, 2006, 17:50

cashy · Post by **cashy** » December 18th, 2006, 17:55

Post by **Dog Pants** » December 18th, 2006, 18:27

Crikey!

Post by **Joose** » December 18th, 2006, 18:54

spoodie wrote: I think you're being a bit harsh, Sandwich is entitled to his opinion even if it is a bit offensive to believers and WEY doesn't seem to have a problem with it. Why not discuss it rather than shout him down? Ya cowards!

Sorry, i didnt mean to imply that his opinion is worthless. Just that the way he put it could be worded better. Ive got no problem with people not believing in god, any more than I have a problem with the opposite. Its just that calling people idiots for their religious beliefs irks me.

Fear · Post by **Fear** » December 18th, 2006, 19:04

I'm half way through this:

(click it)

Some of you sound like you'd enjoy reading it.

I've kinda stopped reading it mainly becuase the last thing I want to do is read after staring at a monitor all day. Good book tho.

Post by **Roman Totale** » December 18th, 2006, 19:13

I'd much rather read Oolon Colluphid's works:

Where God Went Wrong
Some More of God's Greatest Mistakes
Who Is This God Person Anyway?
Well That About Wraps It Up for God

Douglas Adams had some fantastic pieces on religion. I particularly like the piece on Babel Fish, where God disappears in a 'puff of logic'.

Sandwich · Post by **Sandwich** » December 18th, 2006, 20:03

Ok, i'm having words put in my mouth here and i don't like the taste.

I never called religious people idiots. I don't even know if the guy making the program is religious. Although i do think that not questioning beleifs is a silly thing to do.

I thought my implications were clear, the documentary seems from the synopsis to be ill founded and bias.

Post by **tandino** » December 18th, 2006, 20:05

Quick!!!

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/tandino/312945652/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://static.flickr.com/116/312945652_cc37b520c2.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="Internetfight!"></a>

Thought I'd get a preemtive one in before the crucifix hits the fence.

Me, I believe in the most ridiculous sounding, fringe theories in the world but if I had to label myself it'd be as a wannabe Buddhist* Scientist Communist Socio Anarchist.

*Hence the tattoo

<img src="http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0SACGD9QU ... 443"></img>

My official standpoint is fuck it, let people find solace in whatever they want, provided they don't start wars over it.

Merry Christmas!

Post by **Dog Pants** » December 18th, 2006, 20:55

Crikey!

Post by **Joose** » December 18th, 2006, 20:58

Sandwich wrote:Ok, i'm having words put in my mouth here and i don't like the taste.

I never called religious people idiots.

I'm supposing that given that we're all pretty rational that most of us adhere to atheism or agnosticism.

Inference: if you dont adhere to atheism or agnosticism you are irrational.

Im just saying that this is another of those time where what you said *sounds* really insulting, regardless of what you actually meant by it.

Although i do think that not questioning beleifs is a silly thing to do.

that I can definately agree on. One bit of buddhism that I really like, it *demands* that you question *everything*, properly and logically.

Post by **Roman Totale** » December 18th, 2006, 21:59

So, did anyone watch the programme then...?

Fear · Post by **Fear** » December 18th, 2006, 22:08

As buddism doesn't really have a God, or Gods, is it a religion? More just a set of standards or guides?

I know this is probably just playing with words here, but to me religion implies a creator/creators. I also know very little about Buddism so I may be just writting utter bollocks.

Fear · Post by **Fear** » December 18th, 2006, 22:09

An nope didn't watch it.

I don't do television.

Post by **Dr. kitteny berk** » December 18th, 2006, 22:14

Pastafarianism FTW.

That is all.

spoodie · Post by **spoodie** » December 18th, 2006, 22:36

Roman Totale wrote:So, did anyone watch the programme then...?

I saw about 3 minutes while avoiding the ad breaks during the hogfather. The moral message at the end of the hogfather was probably more useful than the channel 4 show anyway.

cashy · Post by **cashy** » December 18th, 2006, 23:31

Dr. kitteny berk wrote:Pastafarianism FTW.

That is all.

sign me up

I have it saved on sky plus, i might skim through it later. Probably some time later mind you

Chickenz · Post by **Chickenz** » December 19th, 2006, 2:08

I personally was brought up with no religious influences (i.e my parents didnt push me into what i believe) other than telly/school and the like. However my Aunty and Uncle and their children are the most god fearing bunch of wankers ever. They have horse fed their children since birth that this 'God' chap did everything in 7 days, just for the shits and the giggles. I had never had a problem with this untill asked by my uncle why i didnt wish to hold hands to say grace at sunday dinner. To which i politely replied and i qoute 'I believe in darwins theory of evolution, not creationalism' only to discover myself lifted off my chair and dragged to the living room where i was promptly chewed a new asshole for not giving god a chance.

Now i firmly and personally believe that:

A. Religion is the root of all evil and that without it the world WOULD be a better place. None of this aha my Lvl .16 Gannesh with his 8 arms could easily take down your Lvl .19 God and his army of followers bullshit.

B. All religion (christianity im looking at you here) and there 'Stories' are simply nothing but Big Hyped Up Books Of Bed Time Stories designed to frighten badly behaved children.

but for they are my personal views and unlike my uncle and his god-fearing family i would never...ever dream of trying to horse my views on anyone else.

Here Endeth thee Rant

Post by **FatherJack** » December 19th, 2006, 2:56

Meh to this thread. I think Bill and Ted summed it up best: "Be excellent to each other."

Some of what my [largely church-going] family's churches do is good: providing real help to some of the most run-down areas of the city and trying to maintain a sense of community in a society that's forgotten what that means. Also our funerals are actually quite fun, especially the odd looks we get from other people at the crem.

However you don't need to be religious to be a decent person, and indeed, a number of people who attend those churches seem to have forgotten those wise words from the Excellent Adventure and think it's all about personal salvation.

I saw a thing on TV about a church in Birmingham that was also a shopping centre and thought that was a great idea, too: not being scared to challenge biblical things. The Creationism vs. Darwinism thing is missing the point a bit - that's another religion and another testament.

Despite my username, I don't particularly believe in anything, other than that you should be a considerate human being, regardless of whether or not you believe there is a celestial entity keeping score.

Edit: oh, and DRINK!

Woo Elephant Yeah · Post by **Woo Elephant Yeah** » December 19th, 2006, 8:16

M4niachicken wrote: Now i firmly and personally believe that:

A. Religion is the root of all evil and that without it the world WOULD be a better place. None of this aha my Lvl .16 Gannesh with his 8 arms could easily take down your Lvl .19 God and his army of followers bullshit.

B. All religion (christianity im looking at you here) and there 'Stories' are simply nothing but Big Hyped Up Books Of Bed Time Stories designed to frighten badly behaved children.

but for they are my personal views and unlike my uncle and his god-fearing family i would never...ever dream of trying to horse my views on anyone else.

Here Endeth thee Rant

THAT

Post by **tandino** » December 19th, 2006, 9:20

Fear wrote:As buddism doesn't really have a God, or Gods, is it a religion? More just a set of standards or guides?

I know this is probably just playing with words here, but to me religion implies a creator/creators. I also know very little about Buddism so I may be just writting utter bollocks.

Yeah, that's it exactly (right that it's not a religion, not that you're typing bollocks). It's essentially all about being excellent to eachother. I say a 'wannabe Buddhist' because I enjoy a drink (read: getting leathered), an occasional smoke (joint or otherwise) and rely on earning a wage and living from that whilst learning as much as possible, rather than the typical Buddhist Monk's daily jaunt down to the nearest village to pick up donations of food from the masses.

But fuck me, if there's ever a set of beliefs or a philosophy to adhere to it's the one that encourages a kind of 'oneness' with the world, from plants to animals to cu<b></b>nts (it has it's downsides). I believe in science, kindness leading to no specific personal gain and all that other gubbins that most would have me committed for saying aloud.

But yeah, Bill & Ted had it right, spot on.

/tangent

I didn't watch this last night as I went to the pub instead. I might sweep it over Christmas mind.