5punk

Has anyone ever done one of these? My mate is doing one at the min and it sounds great!

I'm just sooo bored of my job! The pay is good for what I do but its still crap! Everyone keeps telling me to go into IT since im "ok" on pc's and I do really enjoy working on them.

I was thinking about doing the microsoft networking one can't remember the propper title.

Its about 2.5 years BUT its 5k! They help you find work at the end of it which they say is about 25k a year!

Any advice?

Personally I'm very sceptical about these. Consider whether they're recognised industry qualifications first. Then think about how over-subscribed the IT support industry is, and that the average wage is about £16,000 p/a. A MCSE or MCSA (Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer/Administrator) isn't a bad qualification to have, but many people have travelled that road before you - too many it would seem. From what I can gather working in the obscure corner of the industry that I do, a Cisco course (CCSA) is a safer bet. Network administration seems to be more in demand at the moment. As I said though, I work in an obscure corner of the industry and may have a distorted view of it.

I know they do cisco courses, and I am wanting to do some sort of network course tho. They will send someone out to talk to me about it and pick the right course. The one me mate is doing is a microsoft course so you can use it anywhere.

What do you think is the best way to get into IT, I dont wanna go back to Uni tho!

Cheers

Dog Pants wrote:Personally I'm very sceptical about these. Consider whether they're recognised industry qualifications first. Then think about how over-subscribed the IT support industry is, and that the average wage is about £16,000 p/a. A MCSE or MCSA (Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer/Administrator) isn't a bad qualification to have, but many people have travelled that road before you - too many it would seem. From what I can gather working in the obscure corner of the industry that I do, a Cisco course (CCSA) is a safer bet. Network administration seems to be more in demand at the moment. As I said though, I work in an obscure corner of the industry and may have a distorted view of it.

That

redrum217uk wrote:I know they do cisco courses, and I am wanting to do some sort of network course tho. They will send someone out to talk to me about it and pick the right course. The one me mate is doing is a microsoft course so you can use it anywhere.

What do you think is the best way to get into IT, I dont wanna go back to Uni tho!

Cheers

From what I can gather, networking. Like I said though, it's very oversubscribed - lots of people think IT is an easy route to money and so there's a hell of a lot of people vying for the same jobs, many of them with degrees. The people who run these courses don't tell you that, they just want your five grand.

Dog Pants wrote:Personally I'm very sceptical about these. Consider whether they're recognised industry qualifications first. Then think about how over-subscribed the IT support industry is, and that the average wage is about £16,000 p/a. A MCSE or MCSA (Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer/Administrator) isn't a bad qualification to have, but many people have travelled that road before you - too many it would seem. From what I can gather working in the obscure corner of the industry that I do, a Cisco course (CCSA) is a safer bet. Network administration seems to be more in demand at the moment. As I said though, I work in an obscure corner of the industry and the MILITARY may have distorted my view of it.

Fix'd

If you're young, and keen there are places willing to take you on at the bottom - that means assembling PCs for customers, helping people change their password or do their mail merges, or on the network side, plugging cables in or fitting stuff in racks.

Not much money to start with, but if you're lucky you'll find somewhere that will pay for you to get qualifications. A large organisation is more likely to offer training and have more specialised "starter" roles, but at a smaller place you're more likely to get a chance to do more interesting stuff, which can then go on the CV.

With experience as well as qualifications you have a better chance of earning the money they promise. While you could probably learn most of what the courses teach you from the web, the hard bit is getting the opportunity to show what you know in, as DP says, an oversubscribed sector. Having a degree is no guarantee, either - infact it can be a disadvantage.

well its pointless doing that then if I'm not gonna have a job at the end! What else do you guys think maybe a good way to get started? I'm not overly fussy what I do, I like it mess about inside pc's more than program them. My knowlege is quite limited but what I do know I have tought myself.

redrum217uk wrote:I'm keen to explore many areas of IT, I prefer to concentrate on the hardware side of things. I enjoy studying in my free time to gain more knowledge.

Rewritten for CV-friendliness

redrum217uk wrote:well its pointless doing that then if I'm not gonna have a job at the end! What else do you guys think maybe a good way to get started? I'm not overly fussy what I do, I like it mess about inside pc's more than program them. My knowlege is quite limited but what I do know I have tought myself.

Well it does sound like you're keen so that's a good start. Now you need to be able to find the opportunity. Blagging still seems to be an effective method in the industry, not as much as it used to but it's still there. Not so much out-right lying but if you give an air of confidence this can make all the difference. Bear in mind that the tasks you are likely to be given to start with will be well within your capabilities and what you don't know can easily be learnt from the web. That's something I didn't have when I started.


When you're in hopefully you'll get the opportunity to move into a more specialised and better paying area, like networking, database admin, UNIX admin, etc.

I think FatherJack has given the best advice if you're interested in getting in to the IT sector. For sure, the first couple of years the money won't be great, but comparing that to the computeach course, you won't have to pay for any of the training involved. And like he said experience is just as important (if not more) than qualifications. Its what people look for on CVs, its what will set you apart from somebody with a Computeach course. So basically look around for some low level IT jobs in your local area, and compare what they want from you, and if its a couple of qualifications, then go get 'em chump.

Story time...


My experience of working in IT is basically most (and I really do mean most) don't deserve their jobs. The number of idiots in IT that have their jobs because of a piece of paper like the one you are after is a joke.

Now, that sounds like I am being an arrogant tospot, but I know this and stand by it.

I would consider myself to be one of the best people I know on computers, and yes I am doing that arrogant tospot thing again, and I don't have an IT qualification to my name. 100% self taught - though admittedly I had opportunities I could take advantage of.

I started doing IT support for Siemens during secondary school, was asked back every summer and slowly got paid more and more until I was being pulled out of uni lectures on contracts paying £40/hour.

My advice to you if you want to get far in IT is care. That sounds a really obvious and cringe worthy thing to say, but that is why I got where I did. People would ring me up direct, avoiding the IT helpdesk, because they knew I'd begin helping them immediately, be at their desk within 5 minutes and fixing the problem until they were happy with it. Everyone else in IT used to log the call on the system and ignore it until they client gave up caring. I would also explain what happened, what I did to fix it so they new what happened - another thing that infuriates people is IT treating them like a moron (even if they are) and just wizzing in, hammering the keyboard and running away as fast as you can. I would have directors phone me up in board meetings to help them out because even they avoided the others.

It sounds like I was a right brown nosing square, but I wasn't, I'd have laughs with everyone from every department - the opposite in fact. I probably wasn't liked by some in IT because I made them look utterly useless - which narf they were, they didn't deserve their jobs.

Towards the end I pretty much did everything in IT, and I still don't have an IT qualification to my name (well technically I have an Intermediate GNVQ in IT and an A-Level, but to be perfectly honest having a comb in your back pocket proves as much when it comes to actually using a computer).

So, as FJ said you will need to start at the bottom, but by being helpful will soon get you at the top, providing you know your stuff. The worst thing you can do is fall into the trap of not caring, giving up on stuff to easily, talking to them like they are morons, etc.

The biggest problem you will have tho is getting past the 'box-tickers' in personnel that will look for some qualification that they think is relevant, but in reality often proves the opposite.


So in short, don't be a lazy arrogant cupcake, people will notice and you'll move surprisingly fast - same in any career I guess.


Edit:

One of the things I always tried to remember was: IT is there only to serve every other department. There is no other role for IT, again most in IT forget this.

Some very good advice there from Fear.
I've mentioned this before to toher 5punkers, but I'll say it again for your benefit.

The tried and tested method of getting any job is to write to companies you want to work for, and express a real interest in working for them.

If you manage to write to just one company who are just about to go through the "advertising a job" process, you will undoubtedly get a call, and stand a very good chance at getting the job.

You might want to take up a job on a smallish sallary just to get the experience.

It's amazing what you can learn out there on google by just typing in an error message and so on, plus all the Microsoft Technical Documents are a godsend if somewhat baffling at times.

Personally I have done Windows Server, Citrix and numerous other courses, but what companies are really looking for is experience, as no course can teach you that.

I'm not a "learn from books" kind of guy, and hated school, so pretty much everything I know is from on the job experience, so basically get your foot in the door somewhere, and latch onto someone willing to show you the ropes and teahc you stuff.

Speaking of which, where do you live, there may be a job coming up in my place that would suit someone starting out in IT perfectly!

Woo Elephant Yeah wrote:Speaking of which, where do you live, there may be a job coming up in my place that would suit someone starting out in IT perfectly!

Profile says Newcastle - just around the corner from Bristol, then

FatherJack wrote: Profile says Newcastle - just around the corner from Bristol, then

Fuck, you can have my job then! I'm moving in a couple of months.

You might have to join the RAF though.

.

It would only be a temporary role (for now) I'm afraid as we basically don't have enough desktop suport staff now as we are all doing various bits of project work.

Basic stuff such as installing software on desktops and supporting the applications, and then moving onto installing/testing applications on Citrix along with other duties.

PM me if you are interested as I'm pretty sure we could get you the role with me pushing it, however it would only be a few months to begin with, and then possibly more seeing on how things go, and I understand that it's a big thing to leave a secure permanent position to work elsewhere on a temporary basis.

Basicaaly I'd take someone you my wing and show you the ropes and that way you won't be chucked into the deep end too much, and you could learn lots of new skills to stick on your CV, but if you were to prove yourself I can imagine the role becoming a full time one.

and remember, when you shake hands with the boss, it may not be good form to say 'me bums' at the same time

fabyak wrote:and remember, when you shake hands with the boss, it may not be good form to say 'me bums' at the same time

Dog Pants wrote:
Fuck, you can have my job then! I'm moving in a couple of months.

You might have to join the RAF though.

Sure ill be happy to take it off ya hands! Where you off to?

Thanks for all the advice guys! It would be hard to leave the job I have for somthing new and less paid, but it will be worth it in the end! I just need the bottle to do it now lol, I'll have a look in the papers and stuff see what i can find.

Cheers