5punk

I dont think this has been covered before, but I could be wrong and cant be arsed to check properly. Doesnt really matter, I suppose.

I'll be honest from the beginning. I cant decide if this program is genius or arse. I suspect its a mix of the two. And no, thats not a cunning way of saying its genie-arse.

For those who dont have a clue what im on about, Deadliest Warrior is a program that probably came about from some pub conversation. It tries to take a scientific look at who would win in a fight between two of histories most famous warriors. It does an excellent job on the history side of things, although its quite brief and focused mainly on the weapons, they do bring in proper specialised experts on the subjects. The things they test are tested well, utilising proper actual science (the main guy is a scientist by trade, they have an ER doctor to provide a medical viewpoint, and a computer geek to...er...fill in a spreadsheet or something). Also, the vast array of weapons are pretty cool.

There are a fair few things wrong with it. My main beef is the central concept is a bit flawed. Take the Ninja vs Spartan episode. They test all the weapons, thats fine. They take into account the tactics and skills used by both in a fight. They take into account the Spartans armour, and the ninjas trick eggs full of ground glass. All this is fine. But the end fight is a straight, head on fight, one on one. Spartans fought as an army, not individuals. Taking away the army from the spartans is like taking away one of thier key weapons. Similarly, a ninja would not attack head on, they would use stealth to attack their target unawares. So judging which one is the "Deadliest Warrior" in this situation is an unfair test: you may as well say "which is the deadliest if you take away the spartans shield" or "which is the deadliest if the ninja cant use throwing stars".

Thats just one problem I have with this program. There are others: The experts constant willy-waving gets old fast, the tests themselves all presume that the target doesnt try and get out the way (if I saw a viking great axe coming at me, I would move. Maybe thats just me), im slightly suspicious that the "specialised software" they use to simulate the fight isnt just Excel, and the combat scene at the end frequently ignores the conclusions from the test (the morningstar was said to be a definate "killing blow" in the tests, but in the dramatisation the pirate just shrugs it off and keeps coming).

Thing is, even with all these flaws: VIKING VS SAMURAI! PIRATE VS KNIGHT! SPARTAN VS NINJA!

If that doesnt make you want to watch it right away, then you are a very strange kind of man. Unless you are a woman, obviously.

Or a monkey.



Anyway, in conclusion: I recommend it, overall its good, but be prepared for some bits to make you shout "OH, COME ON!"

I saw a few episodes of this, and I facepalmed all the way through it. Never again.

I saw this advertised a while back and the 'wrong' paragraph was my impression from that. I was curious to see what kind of tests they did on the weapons though, and still am. Interesting that a morningstar is a 'definite killing blow', especially to someone who plays beardygames.

I couldn't get into it, for pretty much the reasons you listed.

The FFS outweighed the NINJA VS PIRATE!!!!!111 aspect for me

Dog Pants wrote:I was curious to see what kind of tests they did on the weapons though, and still am. Interesting that a morningstar is a 'definite killing blow', especially to someone who plays beardygames.

Funnily enough, that's the main reason im watching it. The rest of the "science" is a bit tosh, but the tests of how different weapons actually act on flesh and occasionally armour are pretty good. Apart from the fact that the target doesn't move, I cant fault that bit of it at all.

There's some surprises too. I thought the morningstar would be nasty, but it took the top of the head off and pretty effectively scooped the brains out, all in one hit. Similarly surprising was just how effective chainmail is: I knew it was good, but a katana (or it might have been a ninjato, I forget) was rendered pretty much totally useless by it. When you consider that the same sword had just chopped through 3 and a bit pigs (bones and all) in a single hit* that's quite surprising. From the looks of it, add a bit of padding under the chainmail and you may as well be getting hit by a nerf sword.

I was also surprised at how utterly shit a pirates flintlock is. When it didn't misfire, and it didn't miss, it has the penetration of a wet sock. No wonder they used to carry half a dozen of the things, you would need that many to reliably kill one guy.

Ah yes, I remember seeing this on You Have Been Watching:

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msFljrJ7M4A[/media]

From what I remember the only way to get through chainmail effectively was by piercing it, either by arrow, spear, lance or sword. This is the reason swords became longer and more narrow throughout history, so they could jam it inbetween the enemies' armour plates and through the underlying chainmail.

I recently watched the Shaolin monk vs Maori warrior (or some other similar tribal) episode.

The weapons side and training was interesting, Shaolin are skillful and precise, Maori going for brute strength and vicious weapons (shark tooth edged club being fucking nasty). The fight was crap though.

Fwiw, Shaolin monk won, mostly by getting close and stabbing a fucking dagger though the head of the enemy.

Oddly though, it didn't feature the Shaolin Spade (look it up), which quite frankly would have pissed over any weapon the Maori had including the ranged ones.

My problem with it is that it's all bullshit. If it wasn't NINJA vs. SPARTAN, it would be far worse than Mythbusters, which is saying something.

I've only seen that Brooker clip, which didn't endear it to me. Different scenarios favour different winners and that is what games are for. Take two opposing factions, each with strengths and weaknesses and play it out over various battlegrounds.

The whole "who would win in a fight between.." playground nonsense might sound like a good idea, but it's best left to ridiculous fictional works like Celebrity Deathmatch, putting a veneer of science onto the proceedings, then completely disregarding it in the final battle just pisses off everyone.

For the most part I ignore the end fight and thier view on the 'best weapons' rubbish.

If you watch it for the test they do on the weapons, used by people who know what they are talking about, and the damage being examined by a Doctor who patches up UFC fighters, its an awesome show.

First one I saw the placed William Wallace against Shaka Zulu, the Wallace team clearly loved thier subject and were a joy to see in action.

Last nights for exaple - Apache v Gladiator, kept giving the advantage to the Apache because of the ranged weapons, and pointing out that a gladiator wasn't wearing armour to the torso, ignoring the fact quite a few styles of gladiator DID wear a lot of armour, and were built to take a lot of damage.

The physical capabilities of the warrior are ignored, but its fun to see the damage an expert with the weapons can cause.

Joose wrote:Similarly surprising was just how effective chainmail is

I had a shirt of 8mm mail when I was a teenager, and I'm not surprised. Admittedly that was thicker and of better quality steel than the stuff they had back then, but any slashing weapon (like a katana) had no hope whatsoever. A knife would also have had fuck all chance of getting through it, and in fact in the 90s I knew people who were making lighter vests for bouncers. The main threat would be from blunt weapons because of its lack of rigidity. However, the links form a concertina and flex under impact, so do offer some form of padding themselves, and it's only really flexible in one direction. Also worth noting are how comfortable it is to wear (the weight draws it into the body to make it a very snug fit), how warm it is (it acts as a metal string vest when worn under a shirt), and how fucking heavy it is (about 36lb for my small T-shirt sized shirt).

I made the mistake of wearing a chainmail shirt to a fancy dress party once. My shoulders ached for a week.

The history of weapons technology is fascinating and delving into how and why some of the weirder weapons were developed makes a great show. They should dispense with all the sensationalist crap around it and turn it into a proper history show. Sadly if you don't include OMG NINJA in the line up somewhere it'd never make it past the network communists.

I was just looking at the listings for these, and found one they didn't show on TV here.


IRA v Taliban...

Lets go search!

This program is brilliant for getting back from the pub and sitting there with your mates taking bets on who will win

The best bit of any episode was at the end of Spartan vs Ninja, and the experts had been penis waving for the entire episode. At the end, once the Spartan had won, the Ninja's experts response was "yea.... well... if they met in real life the ninja would have just run away anyway..."