5punk

I'm supposing that given that we're all pretty rational that most of us adhere to atheism or agnosticism.

Tonight Channel 4 is showing a program called "the trouble with atheism". Looking in to the synopsis, basically a guy goes around looking for scientific proof that supposedly contradicts atheism beliefs and he goes on to suggest that atheists would cause just as many wars as religion.

Ok, now i'm really fuming about this so i'll try to keep my anger to a minimum. Now, i haven't watched the program yet, but just as a standpoint i want to say the following.

No amount of scientific evidence could prove the existence of God, but it's suggested that all atheists use scientific theory (i.e. matter cannot be created) as a reason not to believe in God. However, even if science could prove that such theory's we're wrong, that doesn't mean we should jump to the conclusion of the surreal.

Anyway, sorry for the rant, but I'll be looking forward to some discussion about the program after. the thing is, i know alot of Christians, and they'll all be smug about it.

edit: in fact the synosis is worse than i thought

"Rod Liddle argues against those who turn to atheism for a rational and moderate approach to today's problems, and says that atheism has high priests and dogmatic beliefs, just like fundamentalist religion"

dogmatic beleifs? the only thing that we share is a lack of belief in God. Talk about stereotyping.

The trouble with Atheism is the douchebags. Same goes for Christianity or any religion.

Hear me now, GOD can suck my hairy balls!

You can pretty much guess my opinion on the subject from that comment up there

Religion is a load of unecessary bollocks, but everyone has the right to believe in what they want, as long as they do not try to impose it upon others.

*Stears well clear of any discussion on the internet relating to Religion*

mrbobbins wrote:*Stears well clear of any discussion on the internet relating to Religion*

[img size=10]http://killsometime.com/Pictures/images/Pic1006.jpg[/img]

mrbobbins wrote:*Stears well clear of any discussion on the internet relating to Religion*

This

HEAD FOR THE HILLS!! They are all nutters on both sides of the fence if you ask me. If people stopped trying to push their beliefs onto others or claiming they were the right ones, the world would be a happier place i reackon.

Gunslinger42 wrote:The trouble with Atheism, and any religion for that matter, is the douchebags who take it too far.

-And create documentaries about it.

Its not so much that i dont think there is a god, there probably is one somewhere, its who this god might be that is the part that i couldnt give two tosses over. I'll cross that bridge when i come to it.

When (if) i die, if im either stood at the pearly gates or at the big reincarnation bowl thing or whatever, then i'd like to think i was being judged on my character and how i chose to live my life, rather than who i chose to brown nose. Because lets face it, (most) people go to church mainly to brown nose god and say "pretty please let me in kthnx".

mrbobbins wrote:*Stears well clear of any discussion on the internet relating to Religion*

Werd

Even I know better than to get into this.

WARNING! SANDWICH-SAYING-STUPID-THINGS-ALERT!

You know that thing you do when you say things that sound very much like "You are all cunts" and "I think you are stupid"? This is one of those times.

As a general rule, if you are going to talk about something as touchy as religion with a bunch of people who, to be honest, you dont know *all that well*, implying things like "people who believe in God are irrational" is a bit of a no-no. It can lead to people thinking you are a fucking idiot. Just so you know.

Not mentioning names (because I know some people would rather not discuss it in public, for whatever reason), but I know of at least 2 5punkers who *do* have some kind of religious beliefs. Im not saying I necassarily agree with them, but on the other hand, I wouldn't call them irrational for it.

oh, and on the note of scientific proof: You might not be able to scientifically proove that god exists, but you cant scientifically proove he doesnt, either. Stuff like "Oooh, but the big bang negates the need for god" and so on misses the point that proving hes not needed doesnt proove he isnt there. Besides, theres always the opposing argument of "Yes, the big bang. God did that". In all, its a silly argument thats never going to be sorted one way or t'other.

I used to be an atheist, now I'm an agnostic. I believe it's important to keep an open mind. I'm not about to worship anyone or anything but I'm not going to completely dismiss the possibility that some entity created all of this. If this thing was capable of it then it's highly unlikely it cares what I think or do.

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" -Socrates

*joins spoodie in the agnostic camp*

I don't think there is a god personally, but I'm not about to flat out deny the possibility.

Gunslinger42 wrote:*joins spoodie in the agnostic camp*

I don't think there is a god personally, but I'm not about to flat out deny the possibility.

A-thirded.

Also, Joose pwns all threads. Ever.

Joose wrote:WARNING! SANDWICH-SAYING-STUPID-THINGS-ALERT!

I think you're being a bit harsh, Sandwich is entitled to his opinion even if it is a bit offensive to believers and WEY doesn't seem to have a problem with it. Why not discuss it rather than shout him down? Ya cowards!

edit: I'll be watching hogfather anyway, even if it isn't very good.

spoodie wrote: I think you're being a bit harsh, Sandwich is entitled to his opinion even if it is a bit offensive to believers and WEY doesn't seem to have a problem with it. Why not discuss it rather than shout him down? Ya cowards!

edit: I'll be watching <strike>hogfather</strike>Choir boys from some bushes anyway, even if it isn't very good.

fixed

Gunslinger42 wrote:The trouble with Atheism is the douchebags. Same goes for Christianity or any religion.

This

I'm not religious, and I really hate people who try to horse their religions on others. By the same yardstick though I get pissed off by people who claim to know that there is 100% definitely no god - fact!

The only fact is that no-one really knows. I refuse to believe the crap about creationism etc, and well, pretty much everything else that's in the bible/koran/torah. However I wouldn't rule out the possibility of their being a "god". Is there a reason for us being here? Don't know. What was there before the 'big bang'? Don't know. Maybe there is a god, but for religious types to claim to know what he wants is just laughable.

Religion has it's uses, but it's also open to abuse (like most things really).

spoodie wrote: "The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" -Socrates

Good use of quotage there.

If religion helps somebody to be a better person or helps them get by with life, then im all for it. Obviously blowing up trains and planes does not fall into this category.
I quite enjoy debating the issue with people of various beliefs and backgrounds, as you can learn allot from people about what they personally get out of religion and how they perceive it. 99% of the time you will probably find there is allot you agree on with them, no matter how different your belief to theirs.

Although having said that, joose was right. Try to be more subtle.

MIkkyo wrote:fixed

Shut up and go and find me a decent gallery of Jesus LOL pictures.

spoodie wrote: Shut up and go and find me a decent gallery of Jesus LOL pictures.

Yes my master.

Bugger, there were only a couple of replies when I started typing my response. I got side-tracked looking for videos of the Mark Steel Lectures.